Yauwana Janam

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

RE: 1000 ஆண்கள், 914 பெண்கள்.

Ashokkumar · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

//ரோமர் 16ம் அதிகாரத்தில் ஊழியக்கார பெண்களைப் பாராட்டும், பெண்கள் ஜெபம் பண்ணும் போதும் தீர்க்கதரிசனம் சொல்லும் போதும் எப்படி இருக்க வேண்டும் என்று சொல்லும் பவுலின் கூற்றை நாம் புரிந்து கொண்டதுதான் தவறு. //

அப்போ, உங்கள் சரியான புரிதலை சொல்லலாமே..

//நல்லது. மனைவியை நேசிப்பது, அன்பு கூறுவது என்றால் என்ன? எப்படி அன்பு கூறுவது? 1 கொரி 13 ம் அதிகாரத்தில் அன்பின் குணாதிசயங்கள் சொல்லப்பட்டிருக்கிறது. இதை எத்தனை ஆண்கள் தியானித்து அதன் படி நடக்கிறார்கள்? இயேசு கிறிஸ்து சபைக்காக தன்னை தாழ்த்தினார், அடிமையின் ரூபமெடுத்தார், பரலோக மகிமையை துற்ந்தார், அசிங்கப்பட்டார், அவமானப்பட்டார், ஜீவனைக் கொடுத்தார்.- இபடியெல்லாம் அன்பு கூர்ந்தார். இது நேசம். அவர் நேசர். இப்படியா ஆண்கள் இருக்கிறார்கள்?.//

இயேசுவின் அளவுக்கு எந்த கணவனாவது ஒரு பெண்ணை (தன் மனைவியை) நேசிப்பானா என்று கேட்டால், இல்லை என்றே சொல்லுவேன். ஆனால், இதற்காக, "நீ இயேசுவின் அளவுக்கு என்னை நேசிக்க வில்லை, அதனால் வேதம் சொல்லும்படியான மனைவியாக இருக்கமாட்டேன்" என்று மனைவிகள் அடம் பிடிக்கலாமா?

//உன் ஆசை அவனைப் பற்றியிருக்கும். அவன் உன்னை ஆண்டு கொள்வான் என்பது சாபம்.அது போல் அதிக வேதனையுடம் பிள்ளை பிறக்கும் என்பதும் ஒரு சாபம். வலியோடுதான் பிள்ளை பிறக்க வேண்டும் என்பதற்காக யாரும் சிசேரியன் பண்ணாமல் இருப்பதில்லையே. வலியோடு பிறப்பதுதான் வசனத்தின்படி பிறப்பது என்று யாரும் சொல்வதில்லை. எவ்வளவு முடியுமோ, அவ்வளவு வலி குறைக்கத் தான் முயற்ச்சிப்போம்.அது போலவே, ஆண்டு கொள்வது என்பது நல்ல விஷயமல்ல. அது சாபம். ஆளுகை செய்யாமல் அன்பு செலுத்துவதே மிகவும் நல்லது.//

சிசேரியன் என்ற பிரசவ முறை, சுகப்பிரசவம் முடியாத போது, செய்யப்படும் மாற்று வழியே. ஆண்டவர் சொன்னது, உங்களுக்கு சாபமாக தெரியலாம், ஆனால் அது அவரது வார்த்தை, அதற்குரிய கனத்தை கொடுப்பதே நம் கடமை.

//தலைக்குத் தனி போஸ்ட் !//

என்ன சொல்ல வரீங்க?

//

//அன்பை நதியாய் பாயச்சுனா பிரச்னை வாராது அப்படி இப்படி ன்னு எல்லாம் பொய் சொல்லவேண்டாம் சகோதரி. கிறிஸ்த்து இந்த சபையின் மீது பாய்ச்சாத அன்பையா ஒரு மனிதன் தன் மனைவி மீது பாய்ச்ச முடியும்? கிறிஸ்த்து அப்படி அன்பை பாய்ச்சியும் சபையின் நிலை மோசமாகதானே உள்ளது? குறை இயேசுவின் அன்பிலா, அல்லது சபையின் கீழ்படிதலிலா? //

இப்ப புரியுதா? குறையுள்ள சபையைத்தான் ஆண்டவர் நேசிக்கிறார். அப்படித் தான் கணவன்மார் இருக்க வேண்டும்.பழுதற்ற நேசம் காட்டும் ஆண்டவருக்கே நம்மால் முழுமையாக கீழ்படியமுடிகிறதில்லை என்றால் ஞானத்தில், அன்பில் குறையுள்ள, பாவிகளான மனிசப் பிறவிகளான கணவன்மார்களுக்கு எப்படி முழுமையாக கீழ்படிய முடியும்? ஏன் அதை எதிர்பார்க்கிறீர்கள்? வலியுறுத்துறீர்கள்? சொல்லிக் காட்டுகிறீர்கள்?//

என்னங்க இது நமக்கு குறை இருந்தாலும் நம்மை நேசிக்கிறார் என்பதால் நாம் குறையோடு இருக்க வேண்டுமா? அவர், பாவிகளையும்தான் நேசிக்கிறார், அப்போ பாவியாகவே இருந்திருக்கலாம் என்று சொல்ல முடியுமா?

//.பழுதற்ற நேசம் காட்டும் ஆண்டவருக்கே நம்மால் முழுமையாக கீழ்படியமுடிகிறதில்லை என்றால் ஞானத்தில், அன்பில் குறையுள்ள, பாவிகளான மனிசப் பிறவிகளான கணவன்மார்களுக்கு எப்படி முழுமையாக கீழ்படிய முடியும்? ஏன் அதை எதிர்பார்க்கிறீர்கள்? வலியுறுத்துறீர்கள்? சொல்லிக் காட்டுகிறீர்கள்?//

அதாவது... கீழ்ப்படிய முடியாது, கீழ்படிய மாட்டோம், கீழ்படிதலை எதிர்ப்பார்க்காதீர்கள் என்று சொல்லுகிறீர்கள். கர்த்தர் உங்களை ஆசீர்வதிப்பாராக.

//நாம் முழுமையாய் கீழ்படியாவிட்டாலும், நம்மிடம் குறை இருந்தாலும் நம்மை குற்றம் சாட்டாமல், எப்போழுதும் உதவி செய்து, எப்போழுதும் தேற்றும் நல் நேசராய் அவர் இருக்கிறார். //

என்னங்க இது, இன்னொரு பதிவில் ஆவியானவர் திட்டுகிறார், கடிந்துகொள்கிறார் ன்னு எழுதிட்டு, இங்க கதை விடறீங்க.

//யாரோ உங்களுக்கு தப்பா சொல்லியிருக்காங்க. தரிசனம் பார்க்கும் உரிமை நம் அனைவருக்கும் உரியது!//

உரிமை பற்றி எல்லாம் எனக்கு அவ்வளவா தெரியாது. என்னை பொறுத்தவரை அனைத்தும் கிருபையே.

//பள்ளி, கல்லூரி தலைமையாசிரியர், கலெக்டர், நீதிபதி, முதலமைச்சர், பிரதம மந்திரியாக பெண்கள் ஆகலாமா? ஆகக் கூடாதா?//

ஆகலாமே.

//அக்காலத்தில் அடிமைகள் இருந்தார்கள். அதை எதிர்த்து பவுல் பேசாமல், எஜமான்களும், அடிமைகளும் எப்படி வாழ வேண்டும் என்றுதான் போதித்தார். அதற்காக அவர் அடிமைத்தன முறையை ஆதரித்தார் என்று சொல்ல முடியுமா? அதை இப்ப ஒழித்துவிட்டதால் சந்தோஷப்படுவாரா, அல்லது - ஏம்ப்பா நான் வசனமெல்லாம் எழுதி வச்சிருக்கேன். இப்படி அடிமைகளே இல்லாமல் ஆக்கிட்டீங்களே என்று வருத்தப்படுவாரா?//

இப்போது அடிமைகள் இல்லை என்று யார் சொன்னது. ஆனால், அவர்களை அடிமைகள் என்று அழைப்பதில்லை,அவ்வளவே.

வேலைக்காரர்கள், Employee என்று வேறு விதமாக அழைக்கிறார்கள். வேதமும் அதில் உள்ள அனைத்து வாசங்களும் எப்போதும் பொருந்தும். நாம் ஆண்டவருடன் பரலோகத்தில் இருக்கும்போது வேண்டுமானால் பொருந்தாமல் போகலாம்.

//வேதமோ, பவுலோ, கிறிஸ்துவோ என்றும் பெண்களுக்கு எதிரானவர்கள் அல்ல. எதிரிகள் என்றும் ஆணாதிக்க மனப்பான்மையுள்ள, சுயநலமிக்க ஆண்கள், ஆண்டவரின் மனதறியா ஊழியக்காரர்கள், மற்றும் பெண்களை வெறுக்கும் பிசாசுதான்.//

முதலாவது, பெண்களுக்கு எதிர்களாக இங்கு (இந்த தளத்தில்) யாரும் இருப்பதாக தெரியவில்லை. நான் உங்கள் கருத்துக்கு எதிராக என்று கூறியுள்ளேன்.

பொதுவாக எந்த ஒரு இரட்சிக்கப்பட்ட ஆணும் "பிசாசு ஆண்களை வெறுக்கிறான்" என்று தங்களை (பெண்களிடமிருந்து) பிரித்து சொல்லமாட்டார்கள். "பிசாசு மனிதர்களை வெறுக்கிறான்" என்றே கூறுவார். ஆனால், இந்த பெண்கள்தான், தங்களை தாங்களே இப்படி பிரித்து கொள்கிறார்கள். இப்படி பெண்ணியம் பேசித்தான் கத்தோலிக்கம் முளைத்தது.

I தீமோத்தேயு இரண்டாம் அதிகாராத்தில் சிலவற்றை கீழே காணலாம்:

11. ஸ்திரீயானவள் எல்லாவற்றிலும் அடக்கமுடையவளாயிருந்து, அமைதலோடு கற்றுக்கொள்ளக்கடவள்.
12. உபதேசம்பண்ணவும், புருஷன்மேல் அதிகாரஞ்செலுத்தவும், ஸ்திரீயானவளுக்கு நான் உத்தரவு கொடுக்கிறதில்லை; அவள் அமைதலாயிருக்கவேண்டும்.
13. என்னத்தினாலெனில், முதலாவது ஆதாம் உருவாக்கப்பட்டான், பின்பு ஏவாள் உருவாக்கப்பட்டாள்.
14. மேலும், ஆதாம் வஞ்சிக்கப்படவில்லை, ஸ்திரீயானவளே வஞ்சிக்கப்பட்டு மீறுதலுக்கு உட்பட்டாள்.
15. அப்படியிருந்தும், தெளிந்த புத்தியோடு விசுவாசத்திலும் அன்பிலும் பரிசுத்தத்திலும் நிலைகொண்டிருந்தால், பிள்ளைப்பேற்றினாலே இரட்சிக்கப்படுவாள்.
//Eventually she had to let her pupil go, hoping that her teachings would be faithfully passed on. This happened. Apollos was skilled at talking and arguing, and he passed on her teachings to the Jews in the public arena - something she as a woman could not do.//

பார்த்தீர்களா?

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

RE: 1000 ஆண்கள், 914 பெண்கள் - Deborah & Prisca

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

RE: 1000 ஆண்கள், 914 பெண்கள்.

Ashokkumar · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

சகோதரி,

//True.Women cannot and should not grow a moustache.//

மீசை வைத்துகொள்ள முடியாது என்று நான் சொல்லவில்லை. Beauty Parlour போக வில்லை என்றால் நம் ஊரில் பாதி பெண்கள் மீசையோடுதான் நடமாடுவார்கள்.

//What are those few things, a woman should not do?//

உதாரனத்திற்க்கு ஒன்று சொல்கிறேன். ஒரு பெண்ணால் கணவனாய் இருக்க முடியாது, தலைமை ஸ்தானம் வேதத்தில் பெண்களுக்கு எங்குமே கொடுக்கப்பட்டதில்லை. இதனால் பெண்களை குறைவாய் எடை போடுவதாக நினைக்க வேண்டாம். உங்களுடைய இடத்தை ஆண்கள் நிரப்பவே முடியாது. என் கூற்று தவறாய் இருந்தால் அபோஸ்தலன் பவுலின் கூற்றும் தவறே.

//Mutual submission is recommended in the Bible.Husbands are asked to love and love only (not to quote Bible verses) even if wives are difficult to love.//

மனைவி நேசிக்க வேண்டாம் என்று நான் கூறினேனா?

//No. They are asked just to love their wives, not to RULE them with love or anything.//

ஆதியாகமம் 3:16 அவர் ஸ்திரீயை நோக்கி: நீ கர்ப்பவதியாயிருக்கும்போது உன் வேதனையை மிகவும் பெருகப்பண்ணுவேன்; வேதனையோடே பிள்ளை பெறுவாய்; உன் ஆசை உன் புருஷனைப் பற்றியிருக்கும், அவன் உன்னை ஆண்டுகொள்ளுவான் என்றார்.
I கொரிந்தியர் 7:39 மனைவியானவள் தன் புருஷன் உயிரோடிருக்குங்காலமளவும் பிரமாணத்தினால் கட்டப்பட்டிருக்கிறாள்;

I கொரிந்தியர் 11:3 ஒவ்வொரு புருஷனுக்கும் கிறிஸ்து தலையாயிருக்கிறாரென்றும், ஸ்திரீக்குப் புருஷன் தலையாயிருக்கிறானென்றும்

மேல சொல்லப்பட்ட வசனங்கள் என்ன சொல்லுகிறது என்று கற்றுதாருங்களேன் பார்க்கலாம். நான் தவறாய் அர்த்தம் கொண்டிருந்தால் திருத்திக்கொள்ள வசதியாய் இருக்கும்.

//They are called Male Chauvnistic Pigs, actually!!//

உண்மை சொல்வதால் இப்படி பெயர் வரும் என்றால் பரவாயில்லை.

//Women are waking up and instead of being doormats, they expect to be treated with love and respect , as daughters of the most high God. அது தான் ஆண்களுக்கு பிடிக்க மாட்டேங்குது!//

பெண்கள் மிதிபடுவதை நான் சகித்துக்கொள்ள மாட்டேன். அவர்கள் அன்புக்கும் மரியாதைக்கும் பாத்திரமானவர்கள். ஆனால், அதிகாரம் என்றும் அவர்களுடையது அல்ல.

//Christian homes are in trouble beacuse they do not let Christ to be the head of the family.//

கிறிஸ்த்து குடும்பத்தில் தலையாய் இருந்தால், மேலே சொல்லப்பட்ட வசனங்கள் குடும்பத்தில் செயல்படும்.

//ஆண்கள் அன்பை நதியாய் பாச்சுனாங்கன்னா, ஏன் குடும்பத்தில் பிரச்சினை வரப் போகுது. அன்பு சகலத்தையும் நம்பும், சகிக்கும், தாங்கும். இப்படிப்பட்ட அன்போடிருக்க ஆண்கள் பழக வேண்டும்.ஆனால் , இதெல்லாம் பெண்களுக்குத்தான் கற்பிக்கப்படுகிறது. ஆண்கள் கூட்டம் என்று போட்டு இதையெல்லாம் அவர்களுக்கு சொல்லிக் கொடுத்தால் என்ன?//

அன்பை நதியாய் பாயச்சுனா பிரச்னை வாராது அப்படி இப்படி ன்னு எல்லாம் பொய் சொல்லவேண்டாம் சகோதரி. கிறிஸ்த்து இந்த சபையின் மீது பாய்ச்சாத அன்பையா ஒரு மனிதன் தன் மனைவி மீது பாய்ச்ச முடியும்? கிறிஸ்த்து அப்படி அன்பை பாய்ச்சியும் சபையின் நிலை மோசமாகதானே உள்ளது? குறை இயேசுவின் அன்பிலா, அல்லது சபையின் கீழ்படிதலிலா?

//Men shouldn't want to rule women and women shouldn't want to rule men. Ruling is ruled out in christianity //

நான் மேல கொடுத்த வசனங்களே இதற்கும் பதில்.

//Where control and manipulation is there by any party, satan will bring confusion.//

புரியலையே.

//I wish you remove the word "RULE" from your vocabulary and replace it with "LOVE".//

//சகோ அசோக் குமார் பார்த்த ஒரு பரலோகக் காட்சி: ஆண்டவர் சுகந்த வாசனையை முகருகிறார். ஆ.. இந்த ஆத்துமா என்னைத் துதிப்பது எவ்வளவு இன்பமாக இருக்கிறது. நான் ஒரு நல்ல வசன வெளிப்பாடு கொடுக்கட்டும் என்று நினைத்து கண்ணைத் திறந்து பார்க்கிறார். பார்த்தால் அது ஒரு மீசையற்ற பெண். Not Eligible To Hear My Voice என்று சொல்லி திரும்ப கண்ணை மூடிக் கொள்கிறார்!//

நானும் பரலோக காட்சி பார்க்க ஆரம்பிச்சுட்டேனா? சகோதரி, உங்க கூட விவாதித்ததற்காக என்னை சாதுவின் லிஸ்டில் வைக்கலாமா?

பெண்கள், இறைவனை துதிப்பதை நான் குறை சொல்லவில்லையே.

மேலும் ஜெயலலிதா ஆட்சி செய்யலாமா போன்ற கேள்விகளுக்கெல்லாம் நான் என்ன செய்ய முடியும். வேலை ஸ்தலத்தில் நான் ஒரு பெண்ணின் கீழ்தான் பணிபுரிகிறேன்.

பவுல், I தீமோத்தேயு இரண்டாம் அதிகாரத்தை பரிசுத்த ஆவியின் ஏவுதலால் எழுதவில்லை என்று சொல்வது போல் உள்ளது உங்கள் வாதம்.

உங்கள் கருத்துகெதிராக நான் அல்ல, பரிசுத்த வேதமே இருக்கிறது.

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

சகோ அசோக் குமார் பார்த்த ஒரு பரலோகக் காட்சி: ஆண்டவர் சுகந்த வாசனையை முகருகிறார். ஆ.. இந்த ஆத்துமா என்னைத் துதிப்பது எவ்வளவு இன்பமாக இருக்கிறது. நான் ஒரு நல்ல வசன வெளிப்பாடு கொடுக்கட்டும் என்று நினைத்து கண்ணைத் திறந்து பார்க்கிறார். பார்த்தால் அது ஒரு மீசையற்ற பெண். Not Eligible To Hear My Voice என்று சொல்லி திரும்ப கண்ணை மூடிக் கொள்கிறார்!

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கிறிஸ்துவுக்குள் ஆம் என்றும் ஆமென் என்றும் இருக்கும் வாக்குத்தத்தங்கள் எல்லாம் ஆண்களுக்கு மட்டுமல்ல , பெண்களுக்கும் உரியதே. சகல ஜாதிகளையும் சீஷராக்குங்கள் என்ற கட்டளை ஆண்களுக்கு மட்டுமல்ல, பெண்களுக்கும் உரியதே.

பெண்கள் ஆண்களை ஆளுகை செய்வது வேதத்தின்படி தவறு என்றால், ஆண்கள் பிற ஆண்களையும் பெண்களையும் ஆளுகை செய்யலாமா? யாரும் யாரையும் ஆளுகை செய்ய வேதம் அனுமதிக்கிறதில்லை.இயேசுவே ஊழியம் கொள்ளும்படி வராமல், ஊழியம் செய்யும் படி தான் வந்தார். சீஷர்களின் கால்களைக் கழுவினார். இப்படிப்பட்ட தாழ்மையுள்ள, வேலைகார மனப்பான்மையுள்ள தலைவர்கள்/(கணவர்கள்) தான் கிறிஸ்துவுக்கு தேவை. Ruling is ruled out in christianity. எனவே போதிக்கும் ஊழியத்தை பெண்களும் செய்யலாம். ஏன் எந்த ஊழியத்தையும் அவர்கள் செய்யலாம். உலகப் பிரகாரமான ஆசிரியப் பணியில் பெண்கள் சிறப்பாக பணி செய்கிறார்கள். அப்படியிருக்க ஆவிக்குரிய காரியங்களை ஏன் அவர்களால் போதிக்க முடியாது? ஆணடவர் ஆணையும் பெண்ணையும் சமமாகப் பார்த்துத்தான் பேசுகிறார்.வெளிப்பாடு கொடுக்கிறார்.போதிக்கும் ஊழியம் யாரையும் rule பண்ணும் ஊழியம் அல்ல. எந்த கிறிஸ்தவ ஊழியமும் யாரையும் rule பண்ணும் ஊழியம் அல்ல.

பெண்கள் rule பண்ணக்கூடாது என்றால் செல்வி ஜெயலலிதா ஆட்சிக்கு வரலாமா? உல்க வேலைகளில் தலைமை பொறுப்பு ஏற்கலாமா? கல்லூரிகளில் ஓட்டுப் போடும் வயது வந்த ஆண்களுக்கு பாடம் சொல்லிக் கொடுக்கலாமா? College Principal, School HM, Collector, Judge போன்ற உயர் பதவிகள் வகிக்கலாமா? வேலை ஸ்தலத்தில் உங்க boss ஒரு பெண் என்றால் என்ன செய்வீர்கள்?

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

Bro Ashokkumar: Like how a man cannot bear a Child in his belly, women also cannot (or should not) do few things.

True.Women cannot and should not grow a moustache.

Like how a man cannot bear a Child in his belly, women also cannot (or should not) do few things.

What are those few things, a woman should not do?

And Wives has to be submissive to their Husbands.

கேட்டு உங்க அன்பில் மகிழும்படியான காரியங்களைச் சொல்லுங்க. உதாரணத்திற்கு: சாப்பிடும்மா, தூங்கும்மா, பாத்திரம் விளக்க இன்று என் டர்ன். நீ டீவீ பாரு. என்றெல்லாம் சொன்னீங்கன்னா அவங்க சந்தோஷமா கீழ்படிவாங்க. என் ஆண்டவனே என்று கூட உங்களை சொல்வாங்க.

Mutual submission is recommended in the Bible.Husbands are asked to love and love only (not to quote Bible verses) even if wives are difficult to love.

And Husbands has to rule them (like Jesus rules the Church) with Love.

No. They are asked just to love their wives, not to RULE them with love or anything.

Many Feminist preachers corrupt the Bible words and twists the truth. Many doesn't say anything against it, because they are afraid that they will be branded as "Male Chauvanists" (I am not sure the spelling is right or wrong).

They are called Male Chauvnistic Pigs, actually!!

Women are waking up and instead of being doormats, they expect to be treated with love and respect , as daughters of the most high God. அது தான் ஆண்களுக்கு பிடிக்க மாட்டேங்குது!

Beleiving, many Christian homes were in trouble because of such feminist preaching.

Christian homes are in trouble beacuse they do not let Christ to be the head of the family.

ஆண்கள் அன்பை நதியாய் பாச்சுனாங்கன்னா, ஏன் குடும்பத்தில் பிரச்சினை வரப் போகுது. அன்பு சகலத்தையும் நம்பும், சகிக்கும், தாங்கும். இப்படிப்பட்ட அன்போடிருக்க ஆண்கள் பழக வேண்டும்.ஆனால் , இதெல்லாம் பெண்களுக்குத்தான் கற்பிக்கப்படுகிறது. ஆண்கள் கூட்டம் என்று போட்டு இதையெல்லாம் அவர்களுக்கு சொல்லிக் கொடுத்தால் என்ன?

And Women cannot rule Men.

Men shouldn't want to rule women and women shouldn't want to rule men. Ruling is ruled out in christianity

If that happens, Satan can easily enter in that Place where the Woman is ruling over Man.

Where control and manipulation is there by any party, satan will bring confusion.

I am sorry to write this in English. I was little busy today, so didn't get time for writing in Tamil, at the same time, I didn't want to delay to give this reply.

Thanks for the reply. I wish you remove the word "RULE" from your vocabulary and replace it with "LOVE".

Ashokkumar · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

Sister.Golda,

I am sorry that I feel that the below words are not from GOD of the Bible. Women has their own place and purpose in the Church / World. Like how a man cannot bear a Child in his belly, women also cannot (or should not) do few things. And Wives has to be submissive to their Husbands. And Husbands has to rule them (like Jesus rules the Church) with Love. Many Feminist preachers corrupt the Bible words and twists the truth. Many doesn't say anything against it, because they are afraid that they will be branded as "Male Chauvanists" (I am not sure the spelling is right or wrong). Satan is playing a clever game here.

Beleiving, many Christian homes were in trouble because of such feminist preaching. Paul clearly says that women shall not be in some position. And Women cannot rule Men. If that happens, Satan can easily enter in that Place where the Woman is ruling over Man.

I am sorry to write this in English. I was little busy today, so didn't get time for writing in Tamil, at the same time, I didn't want to delay to give this reply.

May God Bless You Men & Women,

Ashok

Ps:- Bros and Sis, Please share your views too.

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

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Pastor Allen Hood, who ministers at International House Of Prayers (IHOP), had a very insightful testimony that he shared with the students of an awakening service at IHOP on July 9, 2010. He shared how God broke his religious spirit. One part of his testimony was how God sees his wife compared with how he looked at her. And that is what I am camping on for this article.

When Pastor Allen was married, he expected his wife to be what he wanted her to be. He wanted her to be wherever he was, and to minister in the ways that he ministered. Then one day, God spoke to him: “Before she was your wife, she was my daughter. You wanted her to be a “pastor’s wife.” However, what if I call her to be an evangelist to her neighbor? “ As a result, he repented before God and his wife for how he had treated her.

Whoa! Our God is good, full of wisdom and justice!

Many husbands and wives (including me) believe that the role of a wife is to assist, to support, and to fulfill her husband’s call. Many wives, including me, have had to give up their own desires and ambitions once they married and have children. Unless it is supported by her husband, the opposition from family is a big obstacle for married women. In fact, it usually becomes a roadblock in perusing their own ministry. And if a woman persists to go after ministry, then she might lose her relationship with her husband’s family, and maybe even her own family.

Most godly wives are content to be just a helpmate and to do everything for her husband’s sake, and nothing for herself. This is a wonderful calling and I admire that desire. Yet, some wives sense there is more to life than just that. Besides being a wife and mother, they have an even stronger calling in their life. Some were called by God before they married, and others were saved and have a call through the transformation of God after they married. These women flow with anointing spiritual gifts that reach and bless people. However, if a wife’s vision conflicts with her husband’s, then she will face opposition. Some husbands (whether they are intentional or not) will quote verses from the Bible in order to put guilt on their spouse; the famous one is “wife, submit to your husband (Ephesians 5:22).” They use this as a “weapon” to “control” their wife.

The verse: “Wife, submit to your husband” speaks directly to the wife who is seeking God’s heart. The verse does not say “Husband, tell your wife that she should submit to her husband.” The verse should also not be used by husbands in order to control their wives as well as different situations so that they may get their own way. God gives wives wisdom so that they may receive even greater blessings. One day, each wife will stand before God and be judged by the word of God that has been revealed to her. He will not come to ask husbands how their wives did or did not follow Him. He will only come to a husband and ask him: “Did you love your wife as I loved you?”

Husbands have the responsibility to guide their family to the truth. By following the Lord Jesus’s footsteps, a husband should first love his wife, just as Christ first loved him. As a result of the husband following this principle, the wife’s heart will be melted and softened. She will also be a lot more eager to love her husband and will desire to unite with him and follow him.

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chillsam · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

sjchristopher wrote:
//யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)//
என்னையும் கூட சேத்துகோங்கோ... English இழுபாட்டம் தான்.... :(

கோல்டா இதற்கு மேலும் தாமதித்தால் பிறகு நானே களத்தில் இறங்கி மொழிபெயர்க்க வேண்டியிருக்கும்;அதன் பின்விளைவுகளுக்கு கோல்டாவே பொறுப்பேற்க வேண்டியிருக்கும்..!

sjchristopher · Veteran Member>>>கனி தருக..!

//யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)//

என்னையும் கூட சேத்துகோங்கோ... English இழுபாட்டம் தான்.... :(

Ashokkumar · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

//யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)//

தமிழ் மொழியை பாட மொழியை படித்துவிட்டு, இப்போதும் தமிழ் தளங்களையே தேடி தேடி படிக்கும் மக்களே (நானும்தாங்க).

chillsam · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

golda wrote:
Ashokkumar wrote:
சகோ.கோல்டா,நாம் சொல்லும் விஷயம் எவ்வளவு நல்லதாய் இருந்தாலும், புரிய வேண்டியவர்க்கு புரியாவிட்டால் என்ன பயன்???உங்கள் பதிவுகளை தமிழில் பதியலாமே.
யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)

யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

Ashokkumar wrote:
சகோ.கோல்டா,
நாம் சொல்லும் விஷயம் எவ்வளவு நல்லதாய் இருந்தாலும், புரிய வேண்டியவர்க்கு புரியாவிட்டால் என்ன பயன்???
உங்கள் பதிவுகளை தமிழில் பதியலாமே.

யார் அந்த புரிய வேண்டியவங்க? :)

லீ கிரேடி(Lee Grady) எழுதியதையாவது மொழி பெயர்க்க வேண்டும் என்று தான் என்க்கு ஆசை.

Ashokkumar · Senior Member>>>ஒளி வீசுக..!

சகோ.கோல்டா,

நாம் சொல்லும் விஷயம் எவ்வளவு நல்லதாய் இருந்தாலும், புரிய வேண்டியவர்க்கு புரியாவிட்டால் என்ன பயன்???

உங்கள் பதிவுகளை தமிழில் பதியலாமே.

golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

மீசையைப் பார்த்துதான் ஆண்டவர் பேசுவார், வெளிப்பாடு கொடுப்பார், ஊழியத்திற்கு அழைப்பார் என்று சொல்வதெல்லாம் சகிக்க முடியாதவை.

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You have to understand that God created both genders and one isn't better then the other. God wants His daughters to be very female and He wants His sons to be very male. God loves both genders and we are all made in His imagine. In Christ there is no gender, we are one in Christ. God is neither male or female.

Gender is for reproduction. I am not sure if we will have gender in Heaven? Even though God is not physically both male or female He can be both mother and father in His love.

God is referred to as Father in the scriptures because He was Jesus' Father. Jesus prayed to God as Father because it was God who planted a seed in Mary's womb. God got Mary pregnant which made Him, Jesus Father.

Even though God is Jesus Father He still isn't limited to Gender. God can very much choose to be a Mother. He can also give birth to things. God has both Motherly Characteristics as well as Fatherly Characteristics. In the book of Genesis God says let us make man in our imagine male and female. God was speaking to the God head when He said let us make man.

The Holy Spirit, is the Motherly side of God. Please read Proverbs 8 it talks all about Mother wisdom or the Holy Spirit as Mother. Jesus mentions that you must be born again to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. The Holy Spirit gives birth to our Spirit and flesh gives birth to flesh. It is God's Spirit or Holy Spirit who acts as Mother and gives us New birth so that we can be new creatures in Christ Jesus.

Women are also in the imagine of God and I believe that Satan has done everything he can to put women down because she is also in God's imagine. Women though out history have been persecuted and abused for just being women. I sometimes wonder if women have more of God's personality and Character more then men because women are more persecuted then men for being women. Women are co- creators with God because women have wombs where men do not. Women are the source of nourishment to their children because they have the ability to nurse where men do not.

Most of our nourishment come from mothers instead of fathers. Cows give us milk not bulls,hens give us eggs not roasters, and most of our fruits are actual ovaries of plantes. Ovaries are those things that hold eggs or seeds. Apples, oranges, pears, bananas and must of our fruits are actual ovaries that we eat.

Without mother cow you wouldn't have milk on your breakfast cereal, with out mother cow you wouldn't enjoy ice cream, yogurt, cheese and all those dairy products. There would be no eggs for breakfast without mother hen. So you can see how much mothers are co- creators and nourishers in God's kingdom.

Males are just like Johnny apple seed they only plant but they do not water (nourish their off spring with their bodies only mothers do that.) God creates and nourishes so you can see wher mothers have something more in common with Father God then earthly fathers. They only plant seed that is far as they go.

I like to share a prophetic Word that I belive that Father God gave me and you can disagree with this Word if you want too but this is what I felt the Father said me concerning gender.

I am bringing honor to My daughters. Religion and man has put them down to much degrading them and their bodies. In the last days I will speak of My daughters and of female things to bring them up higher in Me. They are made in My imagine and I will speak of the womb giving Spiritual birth, Spiritual conception, Spiritual milk and nursing to show man that I honor My women, and that their bodies are holy and honorable to Me. I am tired of men degrading women and putting them under their feet. They are made in My imagine and I will speak as a mother and woman to show men that I can be all things to all people. I can be a father and a mother to My children and My daughters are made in My imagine as much as men and I will honor them, and their temples and speak of intimate things about them Spiritually for man has perverted their bodies which upsets me very much. I will bring honor back to the female race and rise them up Higher in Me and they will rule along with Me and man kind. They are not under My feet and nether is man and they are certainly not under man’s feet. I am tired of religion putting women down and so My Spirit will bring them up higher to show man kind that I honor and adore women.

Sincerely

Father God

Wriiten By Pamela.

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Satan for years has hated the woman because she is My co-partner in creating life and My image of motherhood. Satan has caused men to abuse women because he is angry that women are the co-partners with Me in giving life. It was a woman who gave birth to My son, and her offspring bruise satan’s head. This is why he hates the woman. He has perverted her image to bring her down below men but in these last days, I will bring the image of the woman up to be equal with men.

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golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

http://www.themordecaiproject.org/welcome/about/about-lee-grady

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Q. How did you come to focus your ministry on women? That seems kind of strange since you’re a guy.

Lee Grady: Tell me about it! I can promise you I never imagined until a few years ago that God had this unique ministry for me.

It all started in 1999 when I talked to a female pastor who led a church in Virginia. I called her to ask if she would write an article for Charisma defending women preachers. I wanted to run this article because we routinely received many negative comments whenever we published a story about a woman pastor, Bible teacher or evangelist. The critics would send me tons of Christian hate mail telling me that the Bible commands women to stay on the sidelines of ministry.

So I asked this dear lady if she would write an article explaining what the Apostle Paul meant when he said “women must be silent in the churches” (I Cor. 14:34 ). Of course I knew that this verse had been misused to limit women’s ministry involvement, but I didn’t know how to explain this. So I figured this woman—who was a bishop in her denomination, overseeing many churches—would be glad to help out.

I was wrong. The woman told me: “No, I will not write the article. I am tired of defending myself. If these critics want to come to my church and interview the new converts, observe our school and talk to the single moms who have been delivered out of drug addiction through our faith-based program, then they can come and look me in the eye and tell me my ministry is illegitimate. Otherwise, tell them to leave me alone and let me do what I am called to do.”

I had struck a nerve. There was a lot of emotion in her response. Many people had criticized this woman, but she had stayed faithful to her calling. I admired her spunk. But who was going to write the article that I needed?

When I hung up the phone I was discouraged. Then I heard the Holy Spirit whisper something to me that would change my life forever. He said: “Why don’t you defend her?”

I knew the Lord’s voice well enough to discern that this was more than a question. It was an invitation from heaven. God was calling me. It was an opportunity to say yes to Him, even though I had no idea what my yes might require.

I raised my hand and volunteered. “OK Lord, I will defend the women,” I said. I had no idea what I was getting myself into. But an exciting journey began that day.

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golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

The Dark Side Of Submission

Lee Grady

Christian teaching on male headship is often used as a weapon against women. This abuse must be confronted.

Last week during a ministry trip to Hungary I heard a painfully familiar story. Through a translator, a tearful young woman living near Budapest explained that her Christian husband was angrily demanding her absolute submission. This included, among other things, that she clean their house according to his strict standards and that she engage in sexual acts with him that made her feel uncomfortable and dirty.

This lady was not demanding her rights or trying to be disrespectful. She was a godly, humble woman who obviously wanted to please the Lord. But she had been beaten to a pulp emotionally, and she was receiving little help from her pastor—who was either unwilling or unprepared to confront wife abuse.

I've heard so many sickening versions of this scenario. In Kenya recently, several women told me their AIDS-infected husbands often raped them—and then their pastors told them they must submit to this treatment. In some parts of India, even some pastors believe it is acceptable to beat their wives if they argue with them or show any form of disrespect. And in some conservative churches in the United States, women are told that obedience to God is measured by their wifely submission—even if their husbands are addicted to alcohol or pornography, or if they are involved in adulterous affairs.

This distortion of biblical teaching has plunged countless Christian women into depression and emotional trauma. I'm not sure which is worse: The harsh words they hear from their husbands, or the perverse way the Bible is wielded as a leather belt to justify domestic abuse. Here are three truths we must uncover in order to solve this problem:

1. Marriage is not a hierarchy. Traditionalists assume that a Christian marriage is defined as a dominant husband who makes all family decisions while the wife graciously obeys without input. Yet Scripture actually portrays marriage as a loving partnership and refers to the wife as a "fellow heir of the grace of life" (1 Peter 3:7, NASB). And the apostle Paul taught that in the realm of sexuality, husbands and wives share equal authority over each other's bodies (see 1 Cor. 7:4). In other words, submission in this most intimate part of a marriage covenant is mutual, and this same mutuality is the key to any happy marriage; it fosters respect, communication and an enduring bond.

2. Headship is not a license to control. Traditionalists also cite Ephesians 5:23 to remind wives that their husbands are their "heads"—and they believe this term requires some type of dictatorial control in marriage. Yet the Greek word used in this passage, kephale, does not have anything to do with heavy-handed authority and it cannot be used to enforce male domination. Neither does it imply male superiority. The word can either mean "source" (as in the source of a river) or "one who leads into battle" (as a protector).

Neither original definition of this word gives room for abuse. Headship, in its essence, is not about "who's the boss." Rather it refers to the Genesis account of Eve being taken from Adam's side. The husband is the "source" of the wife because she originated from him, and she is intimately connected to him in a mystical union that is unlike any other human relationship.

3. Men who abuse their wives are out of fellowship with God. 1 Peter 3:7 is clear: "You husbands in the same way, live with your wives in an understanding way, as with someone weaker, since she is a woman; and show her honor as a fellow heir of the grace of life, so your prayers will not be hindered." Wife abuse is no trivial sin. Any man who berates his wife, treats her as inferior or engages in abusive behavior (including hitting, kicking, raping, cursing at or threatening punishment) will jeopardize his fellowship with the Lord. He will feel frustrated and convicted until he repents.

(And in the same way, I believe, pastors who silently support abusive husbands by refusing to confront the behavior—or by telling women to submit to the pain—participate in this sin and could find their own prayers hindered.)

Truly Christian marriages, according to the apostle Paul, involve a tender, servant-hearted and unselfish husband who (1) loves his wife "just as Christ also loved the church;" (2) loves her as his own body; and (3) loves her as himself (see Eph. 5:25, 28 33). He stands alongside his wife in faithfulness, and she joyfully respects her husband because he can be trusted. And the two become one.

If we are to uphold this golden standard, we must confront abuse, shelter its victims and provide the tough love and counseling necessary to heal troubled relationships. And we have no business telling women to stay in marriages that actually could put them or their children in danger.

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golda · Guru>>>நிலைத்திருக்க..!

Ten Lies The Church Tells Women

Lee Grady

For centuries, a patriarchal system of control has kept women in spiritual captivity through distortion of the scriptures. It's time to debunk the myths.

By J. Lee Grady

We live in the 21st century, but if we're honest we have to admit that in some ways the church is still in the Dark Ages--especially when we look at the way we treat women.

Even though the Scriptures never portray women as secondary to men, our male-dominated religious system still promotes a warped view of female inferiority. Women are tired of this, and as a man, so am I--because such demeaning attitudes don't reflect God's heart.

Jesus challenged gender prejudice at its core when He directed so much of His ministry toward women. In a Middle Eastern culture that considered women mere property, He healed women, discipled them and commissioned them to minister. Yet today we spend much of our energy denying them opportunities--and using the Bible to defend our prohibitions.

I've identified 10 erroneous views about women that for too long have been circulated in the church, preached from pulpits and written in the study notes of popular Bible translations. I believe we must debunk these lies if we want to see the church fully released to fulfill the Great Commission.

LIE #1. GOD'S ULTIMATE PLAN FOR WOMEN IS THAT THEY SERVE THEIR HUSBANDS.

How sad that so many Christian men view women from a selfish perspective. This view is often promoted by misreading the account of Eve's creation in Genesis 2:18-25, in which Adam is provided a "helpmate." The Hebrew word used here often is translated "companion," denoting intimacy and partnership. But through the centuries it has been used to imply that Eve was some type of domestic appendage.

We men have assumed that God gave Eve to fulfill Adam's sexual needs as well as to serve as his cook, laundress and maid. But the Genesis account does not say this.

After Eve's creation, God did not tell her: "You are Adam's helper; I command you to serve him well." She was not created for servitude; she was fashioned to be a co-laborer with Adam so that they might rule together over creation as God commissioned them to do (see Gen. 1:28).

LIE #2. WOMEN CAN'T BE FULFILLED OR SPIRITUALLY EFFECTIVE WITHOUT A HUSBAND.

From the time she was released from a German death camp in 1944 until her death in 1983, Corrie Ten Boom taught the world about a Savior who could forgive the cruelest Nazi. Yet she never married. Did the fact that she did not have a husband make her less "complete"? Some Christians would say yes.

We have spent so much energy defending the concept of the biblical family that we are guilty of idolizing it. We've preached that a woman's primary responsibility is to find a godly husband, have lots of babies and stay home to raise them for Christ.

But marital status is not a qualifier for ministry. The Bible does not even state whether certain key followers of Jesus, such as the 12 disciples, were married or not.

The highest calling of all believers--married or unmarried--is to develop a relationship with Jesus. Any other earthly relationship is secondary, and Christ Himself warned us never to allow people we love to become idols that distract us from Him.

LIE #3. WOMEN SHOULDN'T WORK OUTSIDE THE HOME.

Many evangelical churches have preached that women who work outside the home are breaking a scriptural commandment, but this conclusion can be reached only by distorting the biblical record. The woman described in Proverbs 31 is often used to bolster a traditional view of the June Cleaver-style matron who spends her day baking casseroles while her husband is at the office. But a careful reading reveals that the Proverbs 31 woman, in her ancient Middle Eastern context, functioned as a real estate agent and ran a textile business.

Titus 2:5 instructs women to "take care of their homes" (New Living Translation). But most scholars would agree that this passage simply exhorts married women not to forsake their children.

It is true that, because of ambition or materialism, some Christian women neglect their children even though the Holy Spirit has urged them to put their career objectives on hold. But rather than placing a legalistic burden on women by telling them that having a career is ungodly, we should tell both men and women to submit their career plans to the Holy Spirit's direction.

LIE #4. WOMEN MUST OBEDIENTLY SUBMIT TO THEIR HUSBANDS IN ALL SITUATIONS.

A distraught Christian woman who was regularly beaten by her husband finally gained the courage to seek counsel from her pastor. After she told him about her husband's fits of rage, the pastor responded, "If your husband kills you, it will be to the glory of God."

The pastor reached this irresponsible conclusion because of a distorted view of "male headship." We often portray marriage as a hierarchy, with husbands on the throne and wives at the footstool, and we use Scripture to justify this view: "Wives...submit to your husbands as you do to the Lord" (Eph. 5:22).

We assume this verse means women have no say in family matters or that their opinion is second-rate. In extreme cases, women have been told to submit to abuse in order to honor male headship. But this is not a Christian view.

Paul also told the Ephesians, "submit to one another" (5:21, emphasis added). I have heard teachings by male clergy on the subject of male headship, but I've never heard a pastor encourage men to submit to their wives! Yet in a loving marriage, a man and woman will defer to one another as they make decisions.

In my 16 years of marriage, my wife and I have had plenty of disagreements. But when we reach an impasse, I don't announce, "I am the head of this house, so what I say goes." Rather, Deborah and I either agree to pray about the matter, or we choose to defer to one another.

The point is never who is in charge. I view my wife as an equal. I am not "over her." We function as one.

LIE #5. A MAN NEEDS TO "COVER" A WOMAN IN HER MINISTRY ACTIVITIES.

This idea came from a distorted interpretation of the apostle Paul's words in 1 Corinthians 11:3, "the head of woman is man" (NKJV). People have used these words to bolster the idea that women are subservient to men or that they cannot approach God without a male authority figure in their lives.

Paul's teaching in 1 Corinthians 11 about head coverings is a difficult passage, and Bible scholars don't agree on its meaning. However, most teach that Paul is addressing specific cultural concerns in first-century Corinth and that he is calling for propriety and order in a society where immorality and paganism had blurred gender distinctions.

Paul was not placing men in a position of generic rulership over women. Because there is "no male or female in Christ" (see Gal. 3:28), women can pray, worship, study the Bible or minister without a man present. How silly to think that a man, because of his gender, could add credibility to prayer or Spirit-empowered ministry! To believe this would be to trust in the flesh.

LIE #6. A WOMAN SHOULD VIEW HER HUSBAND AS THE "PRIEST OF THE HOME."

Search your concordance. Scripture never describes men as "priests of the home." This man-made concept was popularized in evangelical churches in the last century. We have one priest, Jesus Christ, whose blood atoned for our sins. It is a mockery of the gospel to suggest that any human being needs an additional priest apart from the Son of God.

The Bible says all believers are priests (see 1 Pet. 2:9, Rev. 1:6); there is no gender restriction. Husbands function as priests when they pray for their families or when they minister the Word of God to them, and wives also function in this role.

My experience in marriage has been that God speaks both to me and to my wife. He doesn't say to me, "Since you are the head of this house, I'll tell you my plans for your family, and you can tell the others what I said." Often God has revealed His plans to my wife before I heard anything!

Christian men need to stop being defensive and recognize that God has called us to function in unity with our wives. We need to listen to their counsel, consider their opinions, and pray together for the mind of the Lord rather than putting our foot down and shouting, "I am the leader of this family, and what I say goes!"

LIE #7. WOMEN ARE NOT EQUIPPED TO ASSUME LEADERSHIP ROLES.

The most common mistake we make in biblical interpretation occurs when we take one isolated verse and build a doctrine around it--even if the verse seems to contradict other passages. This is often what we do with 1 Tim. 2:12, "I do not allow a woman to teach or exercise authority over a man" (NASB).

Most theologians believe that this passage was addressing an isolated situation in Ephesus. They came to this conclusion after studying the myriad of references in the Bible to women in spiritual authority. The Old Testament records that Deborah was a judge over Israel--and God blessed her leadership in battle (see Judg. 4-5). Other women who held authority over men include Miriam, Huldah and Noadiah.

Jesus issued His first gospel commission to women (see Matt. 28:1-10), and both men and women were empowered to preach on the day of Pentecost (Acts 2:1-4). Priscilla, Chloe and Phoebe were leaders in the early church, and one woman, Junia, is called an apostle by Paul (Rom. 16:7).

The promise of the prophet Joel was that "sons and daughters" would prophesy after the Holy Spirit was given to the church (Joel 2:28, emphasis added). Yet we have taken one misunderstood verse from Paul's writings and used it to negate hundreds of other passages that support the full release of women into ministry.

LIE #8: WOMEN MUST NOT TEACH OR PREACH TO MEN IN A CHURCH SETTING.

Since 1 Timothy 2:12 obviously contradicts the overall biblical endorsement of women in authority, how are we to understand it? What is Paul actually saying in this passage?

In their book I Suffer Not a Woman, Richard and Catherine Clark Kroeger explain that certain cultic worship practices involving female priestesses of Diana had invaded the first-century church. These priestesses promoted blasphemous ideas about sex and spirituality, and they sometimes performed rituals in which they pronounced curses on men and declared female superiority.

What Paul was most likely saying to the Ephesians was this: "I do not allow a woman to teach these cultic heresies, nor do I allow them to usurp authority from men by performing pagan rituals." He was not saying, as some Christians have assumed, "I do not allow godly Christian women to teach the Bible." In his day, Paul would have been thrilled to have had more skilled women who could teach the truth!

LIE #9. WOMEN ARE MORE EASILY DECEIVED THAN MEN.

This idea has been taught by twisting the meaning of 1 Timothy 2:14, which says, "It was not Adam who was deceived, but the woman being quite deceived, fell into transgression" (NLT). Some have suggested that because Eve was tricked by the devil, women have a stronger propensity toward deception. Others have gone so far as to insist that women are to blame for all the evil in the world and are therefore under a greater curse than men.

No respectable Bible scholar in the church today would promote such a view. The Bible clearly states that Adam and Eve were both held guilty by God for their disobedience, and they were both punished. In 1 Timothy, Paul cited the creation account not to place extra blame on Eve but to refute a bizarre teaching that was circulating in Asia Minor.

In the first century, Gnostic heretics were mixing Christianity with paganism. One of their teachings stated that Eve actually liberated the world when she disobeyed God and gained secret knowledge from the devil.

Paul was not teaching that women are more prone to deception. He was explaining that what Eve did was not right, and that the Christian view of the creation was that Adam and Eve sinned when they listened to the serpent.

Women are certainly capable of spreading deception because they have a fallen nature as men do, but there is no evidence that they have greater gullibility. That view is rooted in demeaning stereotypes and prejudice.

LIE #10: WOMEN WHO EXHIBIT STRONG LEADERSHIP QUALITIES HAVE A "SPIRIT OF JEZEBEL."

Once I was listening to Bible teacher Cindy Jacobs speak at a prayer conference in Colorado. When she approached the pulpit, two men who were sitting in front of me turned to each other and began to pray softly

"Lord, we bind the power of the devil from bewitching this audience," one man said, adding, "We bind the power of Jezebel in the name of Jesus." These men believed that the crowd would automatically come under a spirit of deception when Jacob taught them--simply because she was a woman

How absurd! Was Barak "deceived" when he took orders from Deborah? (See Judg. 4:14.) Did baby Jesus come under a harmful influence when Anna prophesied over Him? (See Luke 2:36-38.) Was Apollos spiritually emasculated when he submitted to the teaching of Priscilla? (See Acts 18:26.) Of course not!

To associate godly women with Jezebel, a wicked Old Testament despot, is unfair and offensive, yet men in the church today often pin Jezebel's label on strong, anointed women because they feel threatened by them

Let's stop the insults. If a woman is using manipulation to usurp authority or if she is spreading heresies, then she certainly deserves the Jezebel label--as do men who do such things. But women who walk in spiritual integrity and preach the Word of God with power deserve our respect.

J. Lee Grady, editor of Charisma magazine, has enlarged on this topic in his book, Ten Lies the Church Tells Women.

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No place for girls in 'shining India'

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All this happening in India because deeply rooted norms in India devalue women. India is largely a feudal and patriarchal society, a fact that perpetuates their low status. In addition, in India if one only has daughters he will be reincarnated in a lower caste.

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